Saturday, May 16, 2015

Who Deserves Hell?

Think of those whose intuition tells them there is something more to life, something more than nature, something more than just blind material forces at work in the universe, but then along comes a Sean Carroll, or Lawrence Krauss, Stephen Hawking or Dawkins or some other promoter of the false religion of scientism, and tells them that no, science, physics, evolution, have proven beyond reasonable doubt that there is no God, no hope for an afterlife, no cosmic purpose to existence. If anyone deserves Hell, it not the murderer, or the rapist, or the thief, it those men.

Now, let me make it clear that I don't believe in a literal "Hell". I also don't believe in eternal punishment. I do, however, believe in justice, and in the afterlife, those who not only denied God and human immortality, but used lies and their prominence as "scientists" to influence the masses toward atheism (which leads to despair and hopelessness for society) will pay a price for their crimes against humanity.


  1. 'Eternal' doesn't mean "a really, really long, long time", it means "timeless" Now, while we may sometimes catch glimpses of eternity, the fact remains that we are time-bound creatures: we only vaguely comprehend what it is like to exist timelessly. The best way to translate the idea of "eternal punishment" into terms we can wrap our minds around seems to be "unending punishment".

    To provide an analogy: it is claimed by those who claim to know such things that at the "event horizon" of a black hole time stops -- from the point of view of an outside observer, but not from that of a hypothetical indestructible observer falling into the black hole. That is, from the point of view of the outside observer, it takes the hypothetical indestructible observer falling into the black hole "forever" to complete his fall into the black hole, but from the point of view of hypothetical indestructible observer falling into the black hole, he falls into it instantly.

    So, who *does* deserve Hell?

    But, to sensibly ask the question, does not one need to have *some* idea of what the words 'Heaven' and 'Hell' reference? I think everyone -- including those who affirm the reality of 'Heaven' while denying the reality of 'Hell' -- can agree that 'Hell' refers to a state of being that is 'not-Heaven'. My point being that it seems 'Heaven' is the more important term of the two.

    So, what is 'Heaven' ... and who, if anyone, and by what metric, deserves 'Heaven'? And, as a logical corollary, if there are any persons who do not deserve 'Heaven', is it not the case that they, ipso facto, deserve 'not-Heaven', which is to say, 'Hell'?

    1. Thank you for the comment. Eternity has more than one definition, though "timeless" does seem to be the "theological one. But, it can also mean an endless period of time.

      Most people seem to think of "Heaven" as a "really long time" and some sort of permanent existence without a body or with some sort of spirit "body", but where time still exists. It is hard to imagine ourselves remaining ourselves without time.

      I have no trouble with God being timeless, of course, as He must be. It is hard to imagine us remaining human, and thus us, without a body or time, however. Perhaps we would grow weary of an endless existence in time, though, and seek final rest in the presence of God "timelessly".

      The ultimate hope in Christianity, however, has always been the eventual resurrection of the body. I don't know how a being with a body can be "timeless". Plus, the last book of the New Testament mentions the coming of a "new" Heavens and a new Earth, where presumably those with resurrected bodies will reside in time of some sort. The Gospels show Jesus after resurrection with a body both similar to ours and yet transformed (he can sit down and eat food, yet also pass through walls, etc.) . It certainly shows him existing within time, however, and one would presume, continuing to do so forever, as in time without end.

      GK Chesterton, who I enjoy quoting, wrote this: "We should grow old in eternity, if we were not kept young by death. Providence has to cut immortality into lengths for us, as nurses cut the bread and butter into fingers."

      Presumably, in this instance anyway, he viewed human immortality as meaning an unending existence with time, without which it is hard to see such immortality as being truly human.

    2. I'll try to respond to your points on Heaven, Hell and who deserves what when I have time, but I will get around to it.

      And thanks, Ilion, for taking an interest in commenting here. I once had lots of commenters, but they dwindled over the years to a tiny trickle. I guess that means you're a drop (though not a drip).

  2. "Eternity has more than one definition, though "timeless" does seem to be the "theological one. But, it can also mean an endless period of time. ... I have no trouble with God being timeless, of course, as He must be. It is hard to imagine us remaining human, and thus us, without a body or time, however."

    According to Christianity, the World to Come (as modern Jews call it), or the Resurrection (as1st centry Jews called it), or "Heaven" as nearly everyone calls "the time after the End of Time" can be likened to a marriage between the present time-bound existence with which we are familiar and the timelessness of God's existance.

    And yes, according to Christianity, the World to Come is physical, but it's some sort of super-physicality. We'll have physical bodies, but they'll be "glorified", whatever precisely that means: going by what is reported of Christ after his Resurrection, we won't be as limited by space as we are now. Perhaps we also won't be as limited by time, either.

    1. Every theist can only put their trust in God. The details of the afterlife and our future existence can be fun to speculate on, but they are always in some sense only guesses, but we should never stop such harmless imaginings. To do so gives the atheists an unjustified victory. Our immortality is a reality!

      But whatever form it takes, we must remember that "Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." That's enough.


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